Estelle Clerc - CellX

00:00:01: Welcome to the Rooted in Change

00:00:04: podcast.

00:00:05: Hey, everyone!

00:00:05: My name is Jan and you're listening To The Rooted In Change Podcast.

00:00:08: This show features European clean-tech champions And their solutions to tackle climate crisis.

00:00:13: Today's guest is Estelle, CEO & Co founder of Selex.

00:00:16: Now we've talked about PFAS already a number Of times on this show As safely eliminating these toxic forever chemicals as they are called Is still big challenge And that exactly where Selex comes into They harness bacteria to break down these pollutants.

00:00:31: their biological solution is deployed directly into industrial wastewater facilities and transforms how we treat PFAS.

00:00:38: We'll find out exactly that works with Estelle in just a few minutes, welcome!

00:00:42: Hi but thank you so much for the invitation.

00:00:44: very happy to be here.

00:00:46: Well it's lovely to have you on this show And before we start diving into todays topic and Estelle X I want to know more about you.

00:00:54: So why don't you introduce yourself to our audience?

00:00:57: Absolutely, so I'm Estelle.

00:01:00: I come from the French-speaking part of Switzerland, but it's been quite a while.

00:01:04: I live in Zurich actually about eight years.

00:01:07: The reason why I moved after living in Boston also back to Zurich was really To start my PhD at ETH.

00:01:15: So you know i started a PhD in marine microbiology In two thousand seventeen After being so fascinated by bacteria and studies After doing some internships and research, I really figured out that i wanted to dig into the wonderful world of microorganisms.

00:01:36: For me who has been always attracted deeply to the ocean but also being attracted by the idea of wanting to preserve this mysterious environment... The marine microbiology angle was a no-brainer for me.

00:01:55: So yes, I did this PhD.

00:01:57: I was really basically looking at what bacteria like to eat in the ocean using a very novel microfluidic device so that it's kind of like a microfluide fishing rod allowing me to selectively capture bacteria based on what they liked to eat.

00:02:16: and here i'm studying carbon cycling.

00:02:23: So I was using sugars, because the ocean is a very large reservoir for polysaccharides and organic carbon.

00:02:32: And that was amazing obviously but i thought wait...I could actually completely derive the technology For more application oriented purposes.

00:02:43: Because you know..i loved my research But I've always wanted to have an impact as soon as possible.

00:02:53: you know, coming back to the idea of the ocean and a very important topic related to the marine ecosystem is pollution.

00:03:01: And I thought oh my goodness!

00:03:02: i could use my fishing rod... Right.. ...to build the biggest bank of bacteria that can degrade pollutants right?

00:03:10: This is how the idea first selects the early story of The Startup Idea.

00:03:14: basically

00:03:15: Nice.

00:03:16: Talk about more on Sort of you identified the I guess underlying principle, the underlying technology.

00:03:24: But previous guests have also on this show talked about his journey going from research to well founding.

00:03:32: a company is very different skillsets or very different worlds i would even say right in academia so focused on getting things right working to level almost perfection.

00:03:44: it's very long cycles at times perceived as quite slow and then when A company and the startup.

00:03:51: You're moving at well, this beat of light I guess a times then again with your in deep take.

00:03:57: you know it doesn't always feel that way because here we know the cycles are still long but still its sort of different ballgame.

00:04:03: how was that for me?

00:04:04: maybe can talk more about that?

00:04:05: Yeah so i mean How did they play out?

00:04:07: basically when you look back on story of it uh...I had five years and half PhD to do which is not on topic And as you said, the big transition was to understand how do you even think about building a business?

00:04:23: So what I did alongside my research was take some entrepreneurial courses.

00:04:29: I did three of them like semester-long workshops and this really taught me the basics off.

00:04:36: What's The Business Model?

00:04:37: How Do You Actually Talk To Potential Customers?

00:04:40: They pushed me to go talk to industry quite a jump from, you know being my wonderful and cozy academic bubble.

00:04:52: So but that was like very good exercise But it really also taught me And I learned That My Idea Had Wings.

00:05:01: You Know i talk to pharma, i talked to pesticide producers and so on.

00:05:07: They were really emphasizing how they needed the solutions And this is how it kind of like moved forward, you know.

00:05:17: I had to wait until I graduated in twenty-three To actually be able do the proofs In a lab that works for pollutants.

00:05:28: Then at the same time i realized I couldn't build this alone.

00:05:33: So was dead determined on finding co-founders.

00:05:37: One from business and needed a biotechnologist.

00:05:40: Turns out things are you know, well done.

00:05:43: I did meet both people and now they're my co-founders And we wrote grants together.

00:05:50: We learned that it was a good match.

00:05:52: We were working well together.

00:05:54: This is how then It kind of started to snowball.

00:05:57: We got money...we could hire team.

00:05:59: Then it started To get some traction.

00:06:03: Eventually last March we moved out of ETH Now into our own location in Chile you know, in the techno-bio technopark in Zurich.

00:06:13: So yeah!

00:06:16: And we're going to talk about cellics in just a second.

00:06:18: but there's one more aspect that is related to what you said and he mentioned ETH both sort of for your PhD But also when you describe this um The last years I guess...the ecosystem That you are into?

00:06:34: Is it an unusual one which actually allows these kinds of deep tech companies.

00:06:42: Is there sort of something special about this Zurich area?

00:06:45: Because obviously we've worked with a number of ETH companies in the past and also, A number of ETH founders were already on the show.

00:06:54: so they must be something that's very special because you say Red is very grounded in this research but then on the side he took those entrepreneurial courses and had these very early touchpoints with potential customers already.

00:07:06: that then sort of pushed you towards saying, right.

00:07:09: This is a good idea to go for.

00:07:10: it start the business.

00:07:13: Is there something unique?

00:07:14: You would say

00:07:15: Unique?

00:07:16: I'm not so sure but i think It's extremely well positioned.

00:07:20: The ecosystem itself is really diversified in the structure That provides for startups To kick off potentially bloom.

00:07:31: I mean, we have not only a lot of funding that is available obviously if you apply and your successful so either from the Swiss government directly from ETH with one their programs And really gives us lots of luck for early startups.

00:07:56: It really brings us, you know the means to actually start this journey.

00:08:01: But then there's a lot of courses like the ones that I did either from very early starts and then You know There is the Inno-Swiss Initial Coaching And Then The Next Phases and so on...and they kind of follow you through the Journey!

00:08:16: And i think then there Is Like A Whole Yeah Ecosystem Of Founders Of Networking Events That Brings You all of the network and the connections that you need, either from mentors advisors investors.

00:08:31: And other peers.

00:08:33: because please how I learned from others?

00:08:39: And um i think in Zurich we're extremely well positioned to learn from that.

00:08:44: Lovely yeah!

00:08:45: That's also my outside view but it's always more helpful to hear that from the first hand experience Understood the fundamental principle of what's behind your technology.

00:08:58: But maybe if you want to explain this a bit broader, because I obviously mentioned PFAS in the beginning and we think he talked about it more pollutants.

00:09:06: If You Want To Give Our Listeners A Bit More Insight Into The Problem That You're Tackling And The Corresponding Solution How Would You Position That?

00:09:18: So, basically at Selex our main aim is to put an end the most persistent pollutants.

00:09:24: And with that we start with the forever chemicals PFAS.

00:09:29: Some listeners might have heard about PFAS.

00:09:31: you know these Forever Chemicals so called Forever Chemical.

00:09:35: They've been absolutely used everywhere in industry.

00:09:38: It's what makes textile waterproof and take out containers.

00:09:44: The big problem it gives cancer linked to a healthcare bill of more than sixty billion dollars in the

00:09:51: U.S.,

00:09:51: for example, and has been found to pollute more then twenty-three thousand sites in Europe only?

00:09:57: And that's for those ones who have been measured.

00:10:00: So this big problem comes into the picture of regulations In Europe or any US chemical users and producers of these persistent chemicals.

00:10:14: they are under strict law take care of their waste and cherry on the cake is that more regulations, most strict regulation coming into next two years.

00:10:26: That pushes them really to reach lower norms or concentration in industrial efforts for example.

00:10:36: otherwise they have to face very strong liability heavy fines as you know some people I've seen in newspapers even ended up at prison.

00:10:46: so Long story short, it's a serious problem.

00:10:50: But now the thing is you have to look at how do we deal with PFAS waste?

00:10:54: Either wastewater or soil polluted soil.

00:10:59: The thing is chemicals in general when they're out of production line In their handling process usually end up in wastewater treatment plants.

00:11:11: for the persistent ones, biology that is you know core of every wastewater treatment plant.

00:11:17: There's not the right microorganisms in there and they cannot degrade these very harsh chemicals.

00:11:23: so what do they do?

00:11:24: I mean producers... They take all their waste water or soil.

00:11:31: if it ended up in the soil and burn them It's extremely expensive And obviously far from sustainable.

00:11:40: So this is why, you know at SELEX This goes back to my background and the background of my co-founder Fabienne.

00:11:47: The biotechnologist.

00:11:49: We love bacteria I mean it's a funny thing but we really think that they're just fascinating because if you look other examples They can do anything And i really think You Can Do Anything With Them If You Just Need To Find The Right Ones.

00:12:07: Exactly what we've done at CellX with this microfluidic fishing rod I was talking about before in the past two years, with screened natural but polluted environments.

00:12:19: And we found out you know very rare bacteria that can degrade PFAS.

00:12:24: So it's like finding a needle where the haystack is millions and billions of bacteria right?

00:12:32: So now we have this big bank of more than a hundred different strains that can degrade the most regulated PFAS.

00:12:41: And basically what we're doing at the moment is combining them together in cocktails, it's called consortia or bacteria... ...that work together synergistically to fully degrade PFASs like trophic chain styles.

00:12:56: You know first one eat the long-chain and then second one eat byproduct and so on, until you can fully degrade PFAS.

00:13:05: So what we're doing now is that basically we have validated their function and efficiency in artificial matrices containing PFAS And then there are eight ongoing lab pilots with industrial stakeholders who help us to develop the solution under real polluted wastewater soil So that we can then further bring these products into industrial pilots in the next two years.

00:13:37: The whole name of the game, We want to really provide a cost efficient and sustainable solution for the destruction of PFAS in industrial wastewater And eventually in soil.

00:13:53: Wow!

00:13:53: That's so cool the needles in this really big haystack, and it's super impressive.

00:13:59: This is always where I love to talk with people like you because from outside... It was such a big challenge.

00:14:08: but then you're softer than moving forward so inspiring.

00:14:14: just listening to sort of wonderful experience to reflect upon how far we've come collectively mostly you in that respect, I didn't do much on this journey.

00:14:27: But i do have a follow-up question because when... ...I talk to other water solutions in the space and always having clear understanding of what's the ultimate product?

00:14:39: And how does it look like?

00:14:40: your case is sort of an image or the word consortium sort of the cocktail or bacteria that you use to degrade the different strains of PFAS.

00:14:55: What's it like in your case?

00:14:56: Is this something that you add into the wastewater treatment, how will they apply your bacteria and future?

00:15:02: Okay so here are two aspects I guess for your question How do we implement the bacteria And then actually bring these to market?

00:15:12: So on first one For the wastewater, we are basically planning to use technology that exists because sometimes you don't need to reinvent a wheel.

00:15:24: So for example...for other type of pollutants in this tree oftentimes You use so-called membrane bioreactors.

00:15:33: It's like just big tanks where it can put your waste.

00:15:37: The wastewater comes in and bacteria contained there Because they're specialized to eat these chemicals heat it up, and then the peak fast free wastewater will continue in the industrial treatment trading that is already at the end client side.

00:15:55: So this is for really the waste water and for the soil.

00:16:00: obviously the end goal is to be able to inject the bacteria directly into solid matter.

00:16:06: so we want to do this as a first step into bio piles.

00:16:10: This is what it's done, you know for mediation of oftentimes chlorinated products oil or many other type of other pollutants.

00:16:17: So they take the soil that is highly concentrated in the target pollutant and so they excavate And then they form these big mounds of soil on some kind of like lining material Like a mat That its in situ but ex-situ And then you leave the soil, set a moment to keep the structure of the soy.

00:16:43: Then you can inject the bacteria and they distribute it so that we could stay in there for some time to really do their job.

00:16:51: So this is what implementation looks like now.

00:16:54: We want take different business models than being the one who supply directly the bacteria at the end client.

00:17:02: Here I think our most scalable model because we have IP of the bacteria, we want to find you know.

00:17:10: The right partners to implement so here are the partners would be the wastewater technology providers or remediation companies and there's many of these companies.

00:17:22: There is some very big players Some of whom were actually already in touch And they can... I guess

00:17:29: also have a customer contact, right?

00:17:31: Yeah.

00:17:31: They have the network of customers who are already asking them for these solutions.

00:17:35: you know everybody is asking about PFAS destruction technology now.

00:17:40: so we will license them to bacteria.

00:17:43: So do write to use them and then they will use not only The technologies or engineering pieces that was talking before their knowledge on how To this four other type Of pollutants And Their Network to distribute and implement the product, in that we really believe this is going be highly scalable.

00:18:03: Because it's an international problem right?

00:18:06: And for the production of bacteria... We want use large scale manufacturers with whom you have trusted partnerships To do a minimum amount of tech transfers so they can grow the bacteria at very high levels.

00:18:21: then they will supply to this middle man, you know the distributors and implementers basically.

00:18:29: Yeah!

00:18:29: You just mentioned that it's obviously highly scalable I guess... The other point that i find super important and interesting is that its a lot faster to market right because when we look at traditional deep tech in scale-up journeys if you try to keep the whole value chain in house then you need build all different parts yourself a lot longer, you don't have the expertise necessarily in or end-the-network and customer contacts.

00:18:57: Whereas obviously your experts with the bacteria...

00:19:00: Exactly but we still need this phase to do the scale up.

00:19:04: I mean we needed to validate at industrial level.

00:19:07: so we need to do all chain ourselves prove it then telling all the partners, this is how you need to do it.

00:19:17: This Is How It Functions and then they can take it in go implement basically.

00:19:21: Yeah, gotcha!

00:19:23: And The other part that I like about speed because of such a pressing global problem he also described regulation coming into place where the fines will be dramatic.

00:19:37: no actions taken.

00:19:38: so i guess your solution's really cornerstone there in tackling this and addressing I

00:19:43: mean, the fines are already dramatic.

00:19:47: So it's all ready happening.

00:19:48: you know there is this whole regulation that is called a very famous stock on convention that is already pushing and obligating.

00:20:00: how do say?

00:20:01: The industrial users of PFAS to take care off few molecules among these PFAS.

00:20:07: So they need to treat PFAS.

00:20:09: It's not whether or not the regulations might be rolled back, this is not even in question you know?

00:20:14: This is something that they need tackle.

00:20:17: and for example in Veneto there used to be a PFAS per producer That unfortunately polluted lot of area around their factory And I think it was just last year.

00:20:29: They were really prosecuted and eleven people ended up imprisoned.

00:20:32: so this happening now?

00:20:34: Right yeah Maybe then connected to that because obviously we talked about the speed and We talked about The importance of scaling this up.

00:20:45: And you reflected upon earlier your PhD phase, You know having to do the PhD first finding the co-founders How far would you say if come in?

00:20:54: This you've mentioned the industrial pilots or the Devalidation with a partners.

00:21:00: I think he mentioned eight practice if I remember correctly.

00:21:04: So maybe just reflect a bit more on how this journey from idea to now was?

00:21:09: Yeah, so actually you know the moment where it's an idea.

00:21:14: and then we got our first proof of concept... We started with wanting to prove that technology is efficient in different types for pollutants And these are very important because we can further talk about them afterwards.

00:21:28: but they're not only a PFAS company an industrial microbiome company, but back at the time.

00:21:34: so we took you know pharmaceutical pesticides microplastics and PFAS as the pollutants that we wanted to show that we could manage to get these degraders for.

00:21:47: Funny story you know PFAS.

00:21:49: I took it as my negative control because i wanted to see in order forever chemicals...I wanted for which compounds and we knew it was not working anymore.

00:22:02: Turns out, that worked very well!

00:22:04: So this is where you know actually... We had these results with PFAS And then we realized more talking to industry.

00:22:13: That's even when they were talking to a farmer producer.

00:22:16: They're not talking about their APIs but they are talking to you about PFAS.

00:22:21: so everybody was like okay PFAS and we realize This was what we really needed to focus on.

00:22:30: But so basically, you know then We managed to isolate a lot in the past two years.

00:22:36: In polluted lakes rivers with wastewater treatment plants were into eight hundred meters and in the deep ocean off The coast of LA for example In soil as well a lot.

00:22:49: So this is how we manage to get these bank of degraders And then we've started to characterize them very importantly also for IP, we really created a bank of data.

00:23:02: And this is super important.

00:23:04: to now go into this inference.

00:23:08: so how do you model and know who to combine together?

00:23:14: So at this time in history where have AI machine learning and genomics advances were extremely well positioned to use and leverage all of these tools, to better predict who will work together for you know the best function of degradation.

00:23:32: And that's what we're starting to build now!

00:23:37: To answer a four-year question where we are now is really... We have transitioned one TRL more towards proving it works on real polluted efferents and working also in soil.

00:23:52: so we had this different partners in industry that are giving us different use cases.

00:23:58: So PFAS, in industries already concentrated or it's absorbed or its in you know different matrices, aqueous and solid.

00:24:07: so we really are at the moment where it works best?

00:24:15: And then optimize our consortium!

00:24:17: Now we have had few pointers towards other than other matrices And we really want to make a decision by the end of this year, what are we going bring into industrial pilots?

00:24:31: Hopefully one use case for soil and one use-case for wastewater.

00:24:35: Yeah so... This is more or less where were at moment.

00:24:39: Because you mentioned the advent of AI machine learning and all tools that available now.

00:24:46: I remember when first came out.

00:24:48: it sounds so long ago that long ago, actually.

00:24:52: And for working with biotechnology companies they all saw this great opportunity to just do these R&D processes a lot faster.

00:25:02: before that it always felt like well you might have had an assumption, you know?

00:25:07: These bacteria may work well together.

00:25:10: I guess he would then test that in the lab and go back to your results.

00:25:18: promising as we thought, you know look into that again and again.

00:25:21: And there was quite a time consuming process.

00:25:25: he went super fast in.

00:25:26: I guess now with AI it allows just to do a lot more of this computational work A lot faster maybe even accelerate those testing journeys.

00:25:35: Maybe can give bit inside.

00:25:37: how does actually works on the inside for biotechnology company?

00:25:40: So no i think This is very good question.

00:25:44: so We have started by really understanding how they behave.

00:25:49: Really the phenotypic, it's called angle of each of your strains but then off course.

00:25:57: now we have also completely sequenced the bacteria so you had start to have an idea of How do they function from their genes?

00:26:07: So basically Now what we need to do is predict use the models how these genes can potentially are different from each other into the degradation function, and in to... How can I call it?

00:26:25: Helping the bacteria.

00:26:26: be happy.

00:26:27: There's not only a function of degradation.

00:26:29: you need your bacteria to survive right!

00:26:31: And we have to figure out which of this genes or proteins is important for that function.

00:26:37: Then together You can combine the bacteria, but then you need to go to the lab and test it.

00:26:47: Right?

00:26:47: You need to test that your prediction is correct And this is why I say It's really extremely important To have the two together.

00:26:55: Yeah

00:26:55: That makes a lot of sense.

00:26:57: um...and it's interesting too Have that i guess inside view into how How you guys at cell X Look At I Guess The Different Parameters How tools Can Accelerate it while still obviously following the right set.

00:27:13: So, you know in that sense I guess AI is not a shortcut it's just sort of... It allows you to maybe come up with new ideas and accelerate certain parts of the R&D phase whilst then the LAP phase is still crucial and important as well.

00:27:31: scripted

00:27:32: Absolutely!

00:27:33: Now if i may add one important angle Now, the models and so on are starting to establish this way of working.

00:27:47: Transitioning from a purely lab inference how to combine the bacteria together.

00:27:53: but once you start building your database can become more powerful when you want to predict for example the function degradation of other types of pollutants.

00:28:06: Because this is when you also train your model on real data that, You know which function they produce.

00:28:13: And I think This Is only going to accelerate with time as we build the Data Bank and The different application That will handle that selects

00:28:24: Right very helpful addition.

00:28:26: Thank you for that.

00:28:28: My follow-up question To that would have been We talked a lot about the positives so far both in your, you framed this before as your small bubble and your R&D research community.

00:28:43: And then founding the company finding... Finding your co-founders and so on.

00:28:47: maybe shine a bit of light onto things that were challenging So far.

00:28:51: was there anything that surprised here?

00:28:53: I guess also coming out of this more research driven phase That You Were Not Ready For.

00:28:59: Was There Anything That Surprised You?

00:29:00: Ah, many things.

00:29:02: I mean you know the life in a startup is based on my experience so different from academia.

00:29:08: yeah i think maybe it was a little bit of speed at which to adapt.

00:29:13: now im not saying people but adapt really You're based on the feedback that you get.

00:29:21: basically your client because you need build product thats wanted industry not something that you want to develop only.

00:29:29: So I think here is my first learning was really, That i needed to go out there and talk To potential client leads You know?

00:29:41: To understand And then adapt Refine the.

00:29:47: what Is it that we need to develop?

00:29:50: And then along The same lines Understand at which speed.

00:29:57: now talking about product development, because one very big difference that there is in academia and I mean this many reasons for that.

00:30:07: We cannot do pure research we need to develop a product.

00:30:11: so therefore... This is the very fine line between how much spending time into understanding your system?

00:30:21: And then How fast it's too fast!

00:30:25: a certain amount of information that we need to build the product, the minimum viable products.

00:30:33: That you will be able to commercialize and then once you commercialized what they say in the field is that you can always improve your product but it needs to good enough still because otherwise nobody would want it.

00:30:48: so this little bit's difference speed understanding what you have to develop for who and really understand, the difference between this academic life that I had before.

00:31:07: And we have to move faster now also stay ahead of course because... We are quite lucky in a way there is competition but there's a lot of opportunities still, especially in the biodegradation field.

00:31:29: People think for good reasons that PFAS is not biodegradeable.

00:31:34: so many other companies we know are starting to work on this.

00:31:40: they're awesome though it's very important.

00:31:45: There's

00:31:54: two perspectives that I would reflect upon.

00:31:56: One is the problem you're tackling, so huge and large.

00:32:01: there are a lot of space for solutions to make an impact in order actually help contribute to solution.

00:32:10: as with many others if i'm thinking about energy transition for example That also very big question and you know the space is not a winner.

00:32:20: takes it all one as it might be.

00:32:22: And

00:32:23: in certain

00:32:24: areas so but that's helpful, um...and the other point I think that you pointed out really well sort of that ability and challenge that June always now need to foresee the future to the market signals, the investor's signal that you get.

00:32:47: So we don't build ultimately a product or solution and it doesn't fit in the markets needs I think is really strong one obviously sort of keeps on your toes.

00:32:59: Always alert!

00:33:04: Well now when looked back bit also want look ahead.

00:33:09: thankyou for sharing this challenge.

00:33:13: If you look at to the next three, two five years how will they look for cell X?

00:33:18: What's what's that feel.

00:33:20: Yes so in the next two years as I mentioned before our priorities to validate this at scale.

00:33:27: So next year we want to start the industrial pilots.

00:33:32: first You cannot build a massive membrane bioreactor with hundreds of cubic meter treated per day but We want to have like a ten-to twenty liter membrane bioreactor, either in the lab or at a partner facility.

00:33:48: So this is how you can still manage to really verify all of the biological variables that could change with scale-up and then next year after validation we want validate it on site.

00:34:07: so like typical industrial demonstrator Same for wastewater and for soil.

00:34:15: So basically, For this now actually next week we're going to start our fundraising for seed because We need obviously To cover a runway for these industrial pilots.

00:34:26: it's very important.

00:34:28: And then This will allow us to reach the validation that Will allow Commercialization.

00:34:34: so this is when we really think we can shift revenue stream from pilot Revenue to licensing revenue and start scaling.

00:34:43: So this is when, you know we started seeing different Implementation sites both in Europe and the US because it's quite timely for both parts.

00:34:56: And then at the same time once we reach a market with PFAS We want to develop all the lines of destruction for the types of persistent pollutants.

00:35:07: So now I don't often talk about it, but we actually are working already on another line for pesticide with one other industrial stakeholder and this is a little bit skipping our philosophy of us being in this microbiome company for different type or persistent pollutant.

00:35:28: so as we bring to the market the PFAS bacteria then We want to develop another line for, would it be nanoplastics?

00:35:37: Can they be for another pesticide, antibiotics?

00:35:41: or the list is long of things we could tackle but that will depend a little bit again on market signals.

00:35:49: What's next?

00:35:50: pollutant needs to be tackled with priority and that might change.

00:35:56: so this It's

00:36:01: super exciting because I feel like you're almost acting, one of the farmer companies that always have those long development cycles.

00:36:10: They don't have to be long but if i'm reflecting for example on the COVID vaccines there was a real issue.

00:36:16: they developed this solution and now based on their technology platform cancer treatment and so on, it's also feels like you're doing something similar that you have a platform.

00:36:30: And then commercializing the first application out of that whilst done with additional revenue from licensing your putting money back to next winner in portfolio which is really exciting.

00:36:44: Thank You!

00:36:47: We talked about fundraising.

00:36:50: let stay there for a sec.

00:36:53: How much money are you going to raise?

00:36:54: is the one question?

00:36:55: And if he could choose a type of vestus, because obviously we have quite a number of investors also listening this podcast.

00:37:03: If she can choose an investor who would want to welcome on board after the round.

00:37:10: Okay so we're raising three point five million francs for our validation of the industrial pilots.

00:37:20: We've already one million committed from also our previous round participants.

00:37:28: So now who are my favorites?

00:37:31: There's no names, you know.

00:37:33: I think what is very important to me Is few things.

00:37:38: so these investors need to understand that maybe we have a bit of longer time off development which still compatible with the VC life cycle with a fund, life cycle.

00:37:55: So this is not problem.

00:37:57: but then they need also to understand what's the size of the problems that we're tackling.

00:38:06: and finally I just want you know people who are giving us right amount of freedom But whenever we needed support They were there to do it whether its with them directly or understanding also where they need to have external support.

00:38:26: And there's many funds who do that as well, so I think in the end it comes through a personal fit as well you know?

00:38:36: I also want from whoever supports us um...to learn from these people You know to also grow personally and become uh yeah A more grown-up entrepreneur i guess

00:38:53: and even better CEO.

00:38:55: And I think you're right in your reflection that there's a good number of VCs out there, which will allow you to accomplish exactly what is your support both than the harder times but also allows you to grow personally code to offer the right tools and access to their network.

00:39:19: so fingers crossed No, it seems like you have something really exciting and powerful that you're building there.

00:39:28: So at that fundraise should be... I mean never walk in the park but i feel like you got something then.

00:39:36: You're definitely a big important issue in your relevant industry.

00:39:39: so

00:39:40: fingers crossed thank you!

00:39:42: And my final question is this sort of home reflecting upon all of these what?

00:39:49: What does it keep going?

00:39:50: Because you could have stayed in your little, small bubble or a little.

00:39:53: You couldn't stay near bubble and academia?

00:39:55: It was nice and comfy.

00:39:57: we talked about the oceans at the beginning of this recording And he would've had a comfortable life.

00:40:03: yet she chose The harder one.

00:40:06: being an entrepreneur He just reflect upon sort-of also with next fundraise That willingness to grow be challenged by future investors which is always less uncomfortable or less comfortable right.

00:40:19: so what is it that keeps you going to get up in the morning and be there for that challenge.

00:40:25: I think, um... You know i love this question because its a simple answer from me.

00:40:32: it's the reason why started this journey?

00:40:35: I really want to note have had an impact And thats not given having any impacts on planet environment.

00:40:46: It can go from very small actions and I think it's amazing when we do that already, but... ...I'm deeply invested into wanting to act on pollution.

00:40:59: And what keeps me every day although sometimes difficult is going back okay?

00:41:08: I know why i am doing this!

00:41:09: I will keep on telling my story and trying to convince people, because luckily i like doing that.

00:41:16: So it's also make my life easier until...I try to do this!

00:41:23: And hopefully succeed.

00:41:25: Well thanks for telling your story today Alistelle.

00:41:28: It was really lovely getting your insights into the whole sector.

00:41:34: The complexities how bacteria work which is you know A question I guess most people never reflect upon.

00:41:40: So thanks for sharing your wisdom and insights there, And then we'll keep our fingers crossed For the fundraise.

00:41:48: Good luck with that!

00:41:49: We will follow you progress.

00:41:51: Well thankyou so much for invitation.